Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant

Standing Stone / Menhir
SJ125260
Disputed

Also known as:

Careg y Big

Nearest town:

Llanfyllin (6km SSE)

OS reference:

SJ125260

OS sheet:

125

Latitude:

52° 49' 26.45 N

Longitude:

3° 17' 55.33 W

Added to TMA by

danieljackson

Images (1)
Fieldnotes (1)
Folklore (2)
Miscellaneous (1)

Images

Image of Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant (Standing Stone / Menhir) by postman

Image credit: chris bickerton

postman Jul 2, 2006

Articles

Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant

Standing Stone / Menhir

CARL Sep 2, 2013

Visited 30.8.13

Despite being about 3 metres high and standing right next to the road I nearly missed this first time of looking. The reason is that it is right next to a lamp post on a sharp bend in the road. It is actually next to a house called Gwnfa, if that is any help?

It is nice when ‘old stones’ survive in such (relatively) build up areas.

Well worth a look when visiting the nearby famous (and spectacular) waterfall.

Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant

Standing Stone / Menhir

Rhiannon Oct 5, 2024

Another gravestone of interest [in the churchyard at Llansantffraid-Yn-Mechain] is the one on moulded pillars at the east end of the church, and was pointed out to us as being the stone marking the resting-place of the body of “David Maurice, the Suicide.” Tradition is a little at fault, as this is not the grave; but, for all that, Maurice or Morris may have been buried here in preference (under the circumstance) to the family vault at Llansilin. (...) The story touching David Maurice’s grave is that the entombed committed suicide in the river Tannatt, near to his father’s house, Penybont or Glan Cynlleth. The pool till lately was called “Llyn Dafydd Morris.”
Tradition asserts that D. Maurice, of Penybont, caused the “Carreg y big,” or “stone of contention,” to be removed from the centre of Llanrhaiadr village, in consequence of the great fighting caused by the assumption of the prize-fighter of the neighbourhood of the title of “Captain,” by leaping on the stone and proclaiming himself “Captain Carreg y big.” This was carried to such a pitch that the vicar of Llanrhaiadr begged David Maurice to remove the stone, which he did with a team of oxen, and placed it in his farm-yard; when, lo! and behold! the cattle, horses, sheep, and pigs, like maddened creatures, danced and pranced about the stone, and ending their joust with horning, biting, and eventually killing each other at the shrine of the “stone of contention.”
David Maurice, thinking the place haunted because of the stone, caused it to be rolled into the river near at hand, thinking the “charm would be thereby broken,” but, sad to relate, one morning he himself was found drowned in the pool which was called until lately “Llyn Dafydd Morris.”
The country people look at the death of David Maurice as a just retribution because he had removed the “Carreg y big,” which was said to be a boundary stone, and should not have been disturbed. This story received general credence.

In ‘A History of the Parish of Llansantffraid-Yn-Mechain’ by Thomas Griffiths Jones, in ‘Collections, historical and archaeological, relating to Montgomeryshire’ (1868).

Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant

Standing Stone / Menhir

Rhiannon Jun 9, 2011

Llanrhaiadr-Yn-Mochnant.
Its parochial history and antiquities.
By Thomas W. Hancock.
Careg-y-Big; (the stone of contention, or the Bickering stone). – This stone is surrounded by curious traditions. The following remarks respecting it, from a MS note by the Rev. Edward Edwards, Rector of Llanymynech, have been kindly furnished us by the Rev. Robert Williams, of Llangadwaladr.
“1790. About 150 years ago, Llanrhaiadr-yn-Mochnant was remarkable for its ‘Careg-y-Big,’ a pyramidal stone pillar in the village. To ascend this pillar, and to say ‘Captain Care-y-Big,’ was a general challenge which was sure to end in mischief and bloodshed. These riots often happened on a Sunday evening, and the common enquiry on Monday was, as to how many were killed at Llanrhaiadr the evening before. Mr. Maurice of Penybont [Llanerchemrys], removed the stone and buried it in a deep pool near his own house. There is a tradition that he was drowned in that pool, and the country people believed that the misfortune was a punishment for removing Careg-y-Big.”
The stone was removed doubtless at the instance of the Rev. David Parry, the vicar of Llanrhaiadr, from 1675 to 1682. The poet Huw Morris, in the following stanzas addressed to the Rev. David Parry, alludes to this stone.
“Cas wyd, coeg wyd, cegiden – cweryl,
Careg big y gydben,
Cwynaw tolciaw – can talcen;
Codiad bai yw cadw dy ben.
Lle byddai’r ffraeau rhy ffrom – gwaith rhydost,
A gweithredoedd Sodom,
Duw o’i ras a wnae drosom,
Bwyntio sant i Bant y Siom.”
[Vile art thou, deceitful art thou, the elf – of quarrels,
The bickering-stone of struggles,
There are groans – the bruising of a hundred heads;
To preserve thee is to uphold sin.
Where there existed frays, very severe – shocking work,
And the deeds of Sodom,
God in his grace hath for us,
Appointed a devoted man, to this vale of discontent.] T.W. H.
Tradition says that Mr Maurice removed the stone with a team of oxen, to his residence at Penybont, and that upon its arrival there quite a grotesque scene took place among the horned and unhorned beasts of all kinds in the place. The evil genii accompanying the stone set the whole group in a ferment, and a furor possessed them; and they indulged in all sorts of wild and eccentric antics, each strove to possess the ‘captaincy’ of the stone, in imitation of the Llanrhaiadr frays. Gory fights among them were the result, so that the good gentleman was glad with all speed to remove the stone and cast it into the depths of the nearest pool in the river Tanat. Mr. Edwards describes the stone as ‘pyramidal’; ‘Big,’ verily has the meaning of ‘pointed’ or ‘pyramidal’, but it also means ‘spite,’ ‘bickering’ &c. Stones called ‘Careg-y-big’, are still found, and not unfrequently, in Wales. It is not certain what was the exact shape, or size of the stone. Some old people state that it was used as a horseblock; if so, it probably had an ancient history.

archive.org/stream/collectionshisto06powyuoft#page/320/mode/1up
From v19 of ‘Collections Historical and Archaeological relating to Montgomeryshire and its borders’ (1868).

Llanrhaeadr-ym-Mochnant

Standing Stone / Menhir

TMA Ed Dec 23, 2005

Disputed Antiquity
The Coflein record describes the stone as follows, and suggests it is post medieval in date:

A lamp standard and mile post some 18 inches wide at the base and standing some ten feet high. It bears the date 1770, which is the date that it was probably first used as a mile stone.
(Source: RCAHMW Inventory: Denbighshire, 1914, s. 488)
J Hill 16/09/2004