Orkney forum 49 room
Image by wideford
Orkney

Mess/Mass/Maes/May

close
more_vert

I've recently being studying the Picts, and in particular their interaction with the Viking/Norse, I'm sure that you are aware that in Orkney's case the general lack of place names outwith scandanavian origin has given rise to the war or peace debate regarding Viking /Norse settlement of the islands.

It's generally agreed that over 99% of all Orkney place names derive from the Norse, of course there is always that elusive 1%!!

Also, what about the third type of 1st millenia inhabitants of the islands ..... the Pabbay/Priests .. currently there is a certain amount of historic/ archaeological interest in these settlers/inhabitants (also in Iceland) about which virtually nothing is presently known.

Wideford, what's your view on the war or peace regarding Norse settlement?

FTC

A possible Gaelic meaning for Maes is 'buttock' with no takers.
Peace or war 'twixt Vikings and Picts here. I think I buy into the Celtic populace having died out just before the Vikings moved in. But they could well have had battles in the Orkney Isles before this happened. Visiting Norsemen could well explain the small minority of probable Celtic placenames hereabouts that Marwick noted. As for P- or Q-Celt there is also the contact outwith these islands that led to Viking stock becoming the Lords of the Isles a lot later if you want to pander to 21st century Gaelic imperialism.

hi to both of you, as I am currently reading the Fury of the Northmen(saints,shrines and sea-raiders in the viking age), some gleanings. Apparently the celtic hermit monks from the monastic houses of the north, Iona, Lindisfarne etc, would in springtime sail further north to their island retreats on Orkney, Shetland etc, for the summer, then would sail back on the autumnal westerlys, though this was curtailed from about 800ad because of the viking raids.
Old Norse for holy men was papa or papay, and should be found in the placename where these monks landed. Is that true? Cairnpapple than might have been one of the places they would have taken up temporary residence and preached. They seemed a viscious bunch these vikings and would probably have laid waste to the islands, they were also slave traders so presumably those islanders that were.nt killed would have been transported elsewhere..

Reading through accounts of viking exploration ("The Vikings", by G. Jones is particularly interesting for me) I've noticed that pretty much everywhere they went, they found Irish monks there already. It seems like they clung on to every rock big enough that stuck up out of the sea. You're right - their history (and achievements) seem to be pretty much overlooked. Having said that, there are still people in the great unwashed who think that Columbus was the first European to set foot upon the Americas.