Re: Pretanike-Britain, Breton, Prythain or Picti? | Forum

Maeshowe 16

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follow that cow Apr 30, 2005 16:28:29

Replying to Lianachan

Help with this please. It's commonly agreed that all the variations of the name Britain have derived from the writings of Pytheus of Massalia who, in 325BC, described the inhabitants of these islands as the Pretanike. Most references say that this is the name that the natives called themselves, however, is this not the ancient greek for painted ones.

I believe that when Pytheus asked,"who lives in those islands?", he was answered,
"the painted ones", this he then translated into greek as 'Pretanike'.

The welsh for Britain is Prythain which is commonly held to be the same root as Pretanike, however I believe that this is borrowed from the original Greek word.

Now, whether the 'painted ones' referred to the people or the stones is a different thread entirely.

If I'm talking complete bollocks please let me know!

Littlestone Apr 30, 2005 23:44:51

Replying to follow that cow

Interesting question ftc and not only cant I answer it but I can also feel myself going off at a tangent. However, there's a fascinating little book called Legendary Landscapes* that might help (and even if it doesn't it's good reading :-)

J D Wakefield, the author writes, "... ancient Greek authors frequently wrote of a nation of people they called the 'Hyperboreans' who sent gifts of first fruits to the island of Delos. The Hyperboreans or 'dwellers beyond the north wind' had a long-standing religious order who were intimately connected with Delos and Delphi. In Grecian mythology Latona the Hyperborean gave birth to Apollo, the god of light under a palm tree at Delos. The etymology of Apollo's name is uncertain but it is highly probable that he too originated in Hyperborea."

In other words Wakefield is suggesting that Apollo is the British Sun God (I think :-).

Right, I don't really know what the f*** I'm on about so I'm off to the Dark and Silent Gate that waits on my pillow before a new and warm Beltane.

* Legendary Landscapes: Secrets of Ancient Wiltshire Revealed. ISBN 09536301-0-02. pp 85-86.

BigSweetie May 1, 2005 11:32:24

Replying to follow that cow

there is a school of thought that the word Prythain (and the Q-Celtic version Cruithne) existed prior to the Greeks using Pretani to describe what is now Britain, the meaning of which isn't known. the Greeks may then have heard this name and because it is similar to their word for "painted ones" started calling Britain the Pretani isles, which would also seem appropriate to them since the "Britons" apparently tattooed themselves or used woad

Cheers
Andy

PeterH May 2, 2005 09:34:58

Replying to follow that cow

"the name that the natives called themselves" - that is probably unanswerable. First you have to be certain that the natives had a concept of single identity - ie nationhood. In the case of the Inuits - apparently that word just means "The People" - we are the people - you are "other"

Names of small groups often derive from a legendary leader or deity, but the inhabitants of large territories had no common identy other than that imposed on them by incomers - traders or invaders. Such names are often descriptive eg Lombards from Langobards (long beards), Barbarians because they gabbled and their language sounded like bar-bar-bar, Picti certainly and probably Pretanike and its variants. On balance, I suspect that the peoples of Britain had no name for "the People of Britain" because they were fractured tribes rather than one nation. For certain sure - they didn't call themselves Celts - nor did anyone else until the 17th century AD

darling_silver Jan 16, 2025 08:16:07

Replying to follow that cow

Pretan/prytan: Britain in Welsh. Nesoi Pretannikai- Aristotle and Ptolemy called Britain. Plato, Timaeus: Athenian laws and public offices were closely related to civic institutions, the center of which was the Prytaneum. Magistrates were called prytaneis, and every executive post prytaneia. Replace the P with a B: bretannikai/Britannica.