I did a quick search for ogam/ogham on stones on the TMA site, but got no hits. I take it this is too "recent" to be of interest on this kind of site?
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T

Branwen wrote:
I did a quick search for ogam/ogham on stones on the TMA site, but got no hits. I take it this is too "recent" to be of interest on this kind of site?
I think there are parameters Branwen, mainly that the sites discussed are prehistoric (ie pre-Roman/Christian). It doesn't mean that some of us aren't interested in ogham which is difficult to date anyway. You won't be surprised to hear that I am interested in the ancient symbolism of trees which is linked to ogham (my particular favourite is the hedgerow elderberry).
I just happened to spend an enjoyable day on the Pembrokeshire island of Caldey last week. Now the home to a Benadictine monastery it seems steeped in 'celtic' christianity but obviously predates all that. The little church of St Davids is built on a Celtic burial ground whilst the church of St Illtyd is the oldest place of catholic worship in the country and stands near to the island's natural water source. An ogham stone was found buried there - it is also has Latin inscribed on it. The story goes that 'Ned the Elder' who died around 1880 stated that other inscribed stones existed on the island but none have been found.
http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm200/TJJackson66/145.jpg
best wishes
I really enjoy your posts ... fearless and honest, thats good.
june
D

The closest on TMA might be this ogam stone which is near the East Millstone Cairn. This stone is just a few meters from the cairn.
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/site/12188/millstone_hill_east.html
H

There's this on Gigha, I think it slipped under the radar of the TMA Eds because it's sort of a standing stone.
Fwiw, there's always the outside chance that one day, someone will uncover a stone with latin, ogham and CnRs on it, and it could be the rock art equivalent of the Rosetta stone :)
F

Branwen wrote:
I did a quick search for ogam/ogham on stones on the TMA site, but got no hits. I take it this is too "recent" to be of interest on this kind of site?
They're all down as standing stones, I think. Here's a few:http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/site/2547/breastagh.html
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/site/1537/donard.html
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/site/11062/darrynane_more.html
(the last one should be Darrynane Beg, not Darrynane More)
W

In 1872 they found an ogham-inscribed Celtic cross at the Broch of Burrian on North Ronaldsay in Orkney. Still undeciphered AFAIK. In summer 1883 a horizontal line was found in Hoy churchyard with markings on both sides. Next year, a rubbing having been taken, various translations were attempted of the ogham and the 'winner' showed it as representing a few lines taken from the text of a specific old Irish tale. And then someone mentioned that the grasscutter cleaned his scythe on gravestones and it all faded into mist.
H

Branwen wrote:
I did a quick search for ogam/ogham on stones on the TMA site, but got no hits. I take it this is too "recent" to be of interest on this kind of site?
Phew! That's a real poser for TMA regulators. According to Anne Ross, ogham first arose in Ireland in the 3rd century a.d. O.k., in England, Wales, and southern Scotland, that's well into the Roman period and not acceptable for TMA. But Ireland and northern Scotland never had a Roman period. So where does TMA draw the line there? Are we really going to allow Irish and northern Scottish ogham, but exclude English, Welsh and southern Scottish ogham?I suppose the logical final parameter would be 1 b.c. across the board. But that will give us problems when it comes to sites like the Old Wife's Well, which probably reflects a Roman name for a belief - and a site - that existed before they came.
'Pre-Christian' and 'Pagan' aren't much help either, witness Littlestone's thread 'Circles under Churches'. And what do we say to Essex readers? They accepted Christianity from Canterbury, later rejected it, and then accepted it again from Lindisfarne-trained St. Cedd. Do we accept material from the interim period when they were 're-born pagans'. or not?
Julian Cope's original intention was very simple - stone circles, barrows, etc., are all very clear-cut pre-historic items. But at TMA's present state of development, it's much more difficult. Beliefs were fluid, and over-lapped all the time. Pre-Roman, for example, is not the same as pre-Christian, and neither 'Roman' nor 'Christian' means the same in every area of the British Isles anyway. I'm beginning to wonder how long we can go on hiding under Julian's original parameters.
Come on, Regulators - I think Branwen's question needs addressing now. We've come too far not to. Ogham in Ireland but not in Wales simply doesn't work.
Why not open a new thread entitled 'Where would you like this site to set its parameters?' Leave it open fora pre-stated period - say, 3 months - and then issue new guidelines to suit majority opinion.
Any views on that?