Carol Thatch

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pooley P
pooley Feb 12, 2009 15:42:18
Replying to Squid Tempest

Squid Tempest wrote:
pooley wrote:
I did read your post, and am glad that he repented. I'm sure you will agree that he is the exception, and not the rule.But still, great.
I don't think it ruins my argument at all - It just means that one old boy, and good on him, saw the error of his ways - as a story, it's great as a statistic it is meaningless. sorry, but it is.
Ok, to add to my many other faults I am now ageist. Ok, I can lve with it if you'd like to believe that.
Try to think of them as human beings? great advice, i'll endeavour to give it a go.
I was not assuming that the elderly (or coffin dodgers, if it helps fulfill your opinion of me).
As for not doing it to make yourself feel better, I don't believe you. I don't mean to be insulting, but I'm trying to be honest. I may be wrong, wouldn't be the first time.
So where are your foolproof statistics that he was the exception not the rule? Anything to back that up? Thought not. Until that is proven I will continue to attempt to whittle away at racism bit by little bit.

And even if he was the exception, every mind opened is a victory against racism.

And, yes, you are wrong. I was not doing it to try to please myself, apart from the fact that I wouldn't be able to face myself if I didn't speak up for my own point of view. Do you prefer to keep your opinions to yourself just because it gives you an easy ride? How does that poem go?

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists,
and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Catholics,
and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.

Then they came for me,
and by that time no one was left to speak up.

Where are your statistics to prove he aint the exception? anything to back that up? thought not.
and DO continue to whittle away against racism, i utterly respect it and think it is a worthwhile venture. Choose your targets better though, eh? the younger generation are the ones to go for- the elderly aint gonna be here much longer.
And I agree, that even though he is an exception, he is a good one. I did say it was great in the previous post.

Ok, the main point of my argument is this (getting away from the fact that you have called me uninterested in racism, ageist and a dehumaniser of the old!!) Racism is a terrible thing - we know that. A racist is a bad person - we know that. There are degrees of racism - we don't all agree with that, Golliwogs are not the problem - some agree with that. People from the older generations often don't see anything wrong with casual racism - they don't hate blacks or whoever, but see nothing wrong with describing them in ways we would consider racist.

This is where i sometimes would keep my opinions t myself. When grandad said what he did about the black nurse I smiled and said, that's good, as long as she is looking after you - would you have said to a man not long left for this world - ah, let me tell you why you are wrong to say that - ok, i'll wait till you've stopped coughing up blood.????

and as for that fucking poem!!!!!!!!!
everyone drags that bloody thing out to prove a point or two, for fucks sake i saw sting do it. STING!!!!!!!

S Squid Tempest
Squid Tempest Feb 12, 2009 15:50:03
Replying to pooley

*sigh*

The point is that unless we speak out against racism, it will flourish. This is how my parents brought me up, and I still find it a good rule to live by. It is that simple. Let us drop all the personal stuff and get to the nitty gritty. As I see it, if you do not speak out against racism, you are tacitly agreeing with it. It is irrelevant what the age or sex or creed or colour of person being racist is. If you can't be straight with your own friends and relations, what hope is there?

Edit: and by the way, you said that my grandad was the exception, and made out that this made it pointless saying anything. My point was that even if there is only a small chance of changing someone's mind, it is still worth explaining what you think. So the stats are irrelevant.

As for the poem, it may have become a cliche, but those are still powerful words, and they do express quite clearly that saying/doing nothing is not an option when it comes to racism (or, I suppose more accurately in the case of the poem, facism).

S stray
stray Feb 12, 2009 15:51:18
Replying to pooley

Gollywog. The point is, as I heard Jeremy Hardy say, we now know that when Carol Thatch sees black people she thinks, 'Oh gollywogs'. Glad to see though that you're almost seeing the point of challenging casual racism now. Shansee, and a few others have already made the age point here though. Never mind the poem, I'm surprised I haven't seen the 'baa baa green sheep' apocrypha yet.