Re: animal rights campaigners jailed | Forum

dee Jan 25, 2009 17:52:41

Replying to handofdave

handofdave wrote:

dee wrote:

My point was that her cure could have been researched without animal testing.

Er... are you a physician? Are you suggesting that we substitute people for animals? Granted, there are people who would volunteer, but I'm skeptical that such a statement bears much ground in reality.

I do think that as computer modeling becomes more and more sophisticated, we'll eventually be able to test things out on 'virtual humans'. As to whether a program that sophisticated would achieve the ability to feel pain and suffering is obviously one for the science fiction writers now, but for the time being there really is no substitute for trying things out on living beings, at least for some trials, as harsh as that may be to our sensibilities.

Im obviously not a physician!!! Im also not up to date with the latest 'testing' methods, but there must be alternatives to using live animals, in any case, how is using animals accurate? They cant speak or say how they are 'feeling' after taking a certain drug can they?!! Also, the animals used in testing will have different metabolisms etc to humans so the drug will not work in the same way as it would on a person. I am in favour of human testing, do it on vivisectors!! Ha ha...joke!

minerva Jan 25, 2009 18:02:30

Replying to dee

I always felt so sorry for Linda McCartney, who took drugs that had been tested on animals when she was fighting for her life with breast cancer.

I make no judgments on her. She did so much for the welfare of animals and it was not her fault that all cancer drugs for humans have been tested on animals. Sure, she had the option not to take the drugs. But if one of my loved ones was dying and those drugs could save their life, my ideals would be questioned too as would most people's. The only judgment to be made is why must this be done in the first place. AIDS has proved that there are enough humans willing to be guinea pigs so that others might live.

handofdave Jan 25, 2009 18:04:05

Replying to dee

Like I said, yes, any possible alternative to animal testing should be used. In the case of my friend, we're not talking about drugs.. we're talking about biomechanics, but that's peripheral to the basic point.

How do researchers know how drugs affect test animals? No, they cannot talk, but there's a wide range of ways in which researchers can tell if things are going right or wrong... bioelectric, toxicity monitoring, etc.

I know I'm going to take flak for this, but the hardcore animal rights people do remind me of the hardcore anti-abortionists... they rely on pumping up the most graphic, upsetting aspects in order to sway opinion. It's a complex issue that requires a slightly more nuanced response than painting horrific and oversimplified pictures of the issue.