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Cairn W

Re-used rock art?

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CianMcLiam wrote:
http://www.themodernantiquarian.com/post/71049/cairn_w.html

To me, this looks identical to common or garden open air rock art, it is on one of the orthostats of the ruin of Carin W in front of Cairn T, similar markings are on other stones. This would obviously lead to the conclusion that the rock art is earlier, and not from the bronze age.

Ken , I agreee that ,the stone in the pic is atypical compared with the rock art found in other passage graves and elsewhere in the Loughcrew cairns , but the others are unlike the usual found in the open air even having a quite distinct style .It is maybe no coincidence that the stone is not in a passage and compares with Newgrange where the open air motifs , cups and circles are found on the exterior kerb and and rarely in the passage or chambers .
Deciding whether the carvings were done "for the job " is difficult to prove either way , fwiw , I think the majority were on order but there are later cases like Clava where the marked rocks were probably from a much earlier marked outcrop and saved doing a new one , like Newgrange they certainly wern't carved in situ . I would extend the use of carved rocks from outcrops to use as cist covers , Craig Hill has obvious signs of quarrying as do other sites possibly providing an al frsco cist cover factory .
The dating of RA world wide is showing that is much older than previously believed e.g. Lower Paleolithic so Early Neolithic is almost modern .Clive Waddington suggets Mesolithic but with little evidence .

tiompan wrote:
I would extend the use of carved rocks from outcrops to use as cist covers , Craig Hill has obvious signs of quarrying as do other sites possibly providing an al frsco cist cover factory
A few examples of similar stuff in Northumberland too. Though often the undersides of undeniably BA cists look very fresh, due to the lack of exposure, so some CnRs were obviously still being made in the BA. Then there are those quarry sites like Fowberry North Plantation and Hunterheugh where the quarried motif has been replaced by a newer probably BA motif.

But then there are sites like the Fowberry cairn, which looks a lot older, as if it'd been weathered for a goodly while before being incorporated into a cairn. As it was facing inwards in the cairn, you've got to assume that the weathering took place before inclusion into the BA monument.

As regards the pushing back of dates, I think that lower paleo site in (Chattan?) India, is supposed to be simple cups, mebbe the more complex stuff is a later elaboration on the theme. I wouldn't know one way or the other about the Irish stuff, but I'd be fairly sure that if there was open air RA in the area, the builders of the monuments would be tempted to re-use if they could shift it easily. Given that people were prepared in some places to actually quarry outcrop, it seems a lesser act to move an earthfast boulder (i.e. less chance of dodgy ju-ju from the ancestors). But that's just speculating on the midsets of the ancients, not hard evidence of anything :)

Check your mail.

I thought Richard Bradley was heading in the Mesolithic direction in his book at the start but then didn't. I think it's plausibile.

The carvings on this orthostat seem to have been very wide circles compared to the tighter, skinnier passage tomb art. I'm checking my other pics from Loughcrew but most of the carvings conform to this lighter 'font' with tighter, more precise lines.