Silbury Hill 180
Image by texlahoma

Rhiannon wrote:
Ok then, this is what I've inferred you mean. If you don't want to clarify then how can anyone know what you're really thinking?

who? = anyone who feels like it, including me. Except that I rely on everyone else not doing it, so that I can do it.
Why? = because I can go on these places without damaging them. And I'm really interested in them, unlike most of the visitors.

If everyone visiting applied those two answers to themselves there'd be a lot of people sitting in skara brae and climbing silbury, surely you can see that?
So why aren't there? Because people love rules? No! It's because people respect the monuments themselves and they don't want them ruined.

You depend on those people that "keep the rules" so you don't feel guilty, because their care for the monuments and ability to act in an unselfish, future-considering way enables you to be one of the few people who can do it so then claim you're not damaging it (much).

That is totally hypocritical, surely. You hate the rules (man) but you rely on them at the same time.

Rhiannon, I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with me. That's absolutely fine. We all have different philosophies. But would you please refrain from misrepresenting my views and putting words into my mouth? I don't recall, for example, saying anything about "hating rules" (man).

"who? = anyone who feels like it, including me. Except that I rely on everyone else not doing it, so that I can do it.
Why? = because I can go on these places without damaging them. And I'm really interested in them, unlike most of the visitors.

If everyone visiting applied those two answers to themselves there'd be a lot of people sitting in skara brae and climbing silbury, surely you can see that?"

But back in the real world, not everyone visiting Skara Brae is going to do that, are they? Or they'd already be doing it. As I said earlier, I think the nature of Silbury Hill is such that people climbing it attract the attention of others and encourages others to climb it. Nobody's advocating climbing Silbury Hill.

I can think of a number of places where people are gaining surreptitious access out of hours, not causing any damage and not being noticed. Your argument seems to be that they should stop, despite the fact that their behaviour is having absolutely zero detrimental affect.

Mustard wrote:
Rhiannon wrote:
Ok then, this is what I've inferred you mean. If you don't want to clarify then how can anyone know what you're really thinking?

who? = anyone who feels like it, including me. Except that I rely on everyone else not doing it, so that I can do it.
Why? = because I can go on these places without damaging them. And I'm really interested in them, unlike most of the visitors.

If everyone visiting applied those two answers to themselves there'd be a lot of people sitting in skara brae and climbing silbury, surely you can see that?
So why aren't there? Because people love rules? No! It's because people respect the monuments themselves and they don't want them ruined.

You depend on those people that "keep the rules" so you don't feel guilty, because their care for the monuments and ability to act in an unselfish, future-considering way enables you to be one of the few people who can do it so then claim you're not damaging it (much).

That is totally hypocritical, surely. You hate the rules (man) but you rely on them at the same time.

Rhiannon, I don't have a problem with you disagreeing with me. That's absolutely fine. We all have different philosophies. But would you please refrain from misrepresenting my views and putting words into my mouth? I don't recall, for example, saying anything about "hating rules" (man).

"who? = anyone who feels like it, including me. Except that I rely on everyone else not doing it, so that I can do it.
Why? = because I can go on these places without damaging them. And I'm really interested in them, unlike most of the visitors.

If everyone visiting applied those two answers to themselves there'd be a lot of people sitting in skara brae and climbing silbury, surely you can see that?"

But back in the real world, not everyone visiting Skara Brae is going to do that, are they? Or they'd already be doing it. As I said earlier, I think the nature of Silbury Hill is such that people climbing it attract the attention of others and encourages others to climb it. Nobody's advocating climbing Silbury Hill.

I can think of a number of places where people are gaining surreptitious access out of hours, not causing any damage and not being noticed. Your argument seems to be that they should stop, despite the fact that their behaviour is having absolutely zero detrimental affect.

It is a matter of reality vs. theory. What keeps Assycombe hill safe, just as an exmaple? The ignorant don't want to visit and the people that do don't dig it up and make off with the stones.
That is broadly the entire situation being discussed here.

But you haven't addressed my point, that it seems hypocritical to rely on those who are prepared to put their whims aside and respect the wishes of the people that care for and monitor the site, and so don't walk on it - its their acceptance that they can't do as they please that enables you to do as you please.

Doesn't that make you feel like you're taking the piss a bit? That you're treating yourself as special? That you're telling yourself you're entitled to an experience just because other people are too straight / too silly to grab the chance to do it themselves?